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bumblefoot

its been 11 years since ive had to deal with this and i lost 2 beautiful polish due to it spreading to the bones
Pippy limped a bit yesterday so i picked her up and found the dreaded bumblefoot on both feet . only small on one foot but the width of a pea on the other
theres no room in the hospital pen at the moment so shes going to have to stay out , for a while anyway . shes so flighty and active i think shed go stir crazy in there anyway
last time i used iodine , epsom salt soaks, antibiotics and savlon. have there been any miracle cures found since then? anyone tried Tricide Neo powder? can i even buy it in uk ?
wish me luck , ive a horrible feeling im going to need it
x Kath
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Comments

  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    Much as I'd like to claim success, I've had very little.The only real success I have had was with a hen where the 'bumble' was quite small. I removed it and irrigated the cavity with hydrogen peroxide, then bound the foot with 'vet bind' I repeated this process over several weeks and the bumble eventually healed and sealed.
    I don't know about the powder you mention.....but if it seems to be very effective, then the internet is a good source for pretty much everything.

    Good Luck.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    thanks Sandie
    i googled it and this powder came up to be used as a dip - meant to treat fungus and ulcers on ornamental koi but also used for bumblefoot . trouble is its in america not over here
    im off to the vets with her tomorrow to see if they can help and to get antibiotics. at the moment im just soaking her and applying lots of vetricyn and giving her aspirin - a quarter of a 300 mg tablet to ease some pain . i havent attempted to remove the core yet as its staying pretty solid
    x Kath
  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    If you think that the powder would help, then buy some from the States (if it's not ridiculously expensive). Also worth seeing if there's a British equivalent.Good luck with the bumble, in any case....nasty condition.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    we went to the vets - she did the egg song in the cat carrier in the waiting room , much to the amusement of the sensible people there who actually had cats in their cat carriers. vet remembered the polish having bumblefoot eleven years ago and looked up the notes and saw all the different things we tried then . she suggested i might go to an exotic vet (yikes the taxi fare alone to get there is £12 each way) who may help better but gave me tylan and cream called isaderm - ive had it for a rash my dog got on his chin from picking up a hedgehog ...a very weepy rash
    shed never heard of ticide neo but had heard of neosporin but couldnt prescibe that either
    Pippy is walking around without limping when i put dressings on her . i soaked her twice yesterday in epsom salts water and the scab is looking lighter but still firmly affixed . im hoping i wont have to cut into it to get the plug out.
    some people on you tube seem to be getting results with vetricyne- the spray i use for buffys prolapse - so between bathing and applying the cream im spraying with this too
    will keep you updated
    xKath

  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    Let's hope that it works.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    thank you Sandie
    its been a week . a week of twicw daily soaking in epsom water then spraying with vetericyn, allowing it to dry then isaderm and bandaging
    i ran low on the cream so bought some prid salve that id seen being used on you tube and have used that since
    went to the vet yesterday and she was really pleased with how they both looked and picked off some of the scab without it bleeding.
    just got to keep going now but cant decide which cream worked so vet suggested i use both
    im getting good at the bandaging . my late fiance had a venous leg ulcer and i used to apply a five bandage method to his leg but i didnt have to tip him upside down to do it ):
    xKath
  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    my late fiance had a venous leg ulcer and i used to apply a five bandage method to his leg but i didnt have to tip him upside down to do it ):Just as well!

    I have used hydrogen peroxide in the past when there's a cavity....nice and cheap, too.

    Sandie
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    thanks Sandie
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    Strange, but our local avian vets don't prescribe antibiotics for bumblefoot at all any more.
    We used to make a poultice with iodine and flour and then bandage over. Took two or three weeks though.
    Sadly not heard of a miracle cure yet!
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    hi
    i used iodine with sugar on the polish
    theres no swelling at all and the scabs have been removed and theres healthy skin underneath but i reckon theres poison under one as it looks yellowish
    continuing with the epsom salts bath / prid and isaderm and funky bandaging . she doesnt limp at all so i cant think that theres a plug there as there usually is . odd
    btw that isaderm is brilliant - George had a small spot near his eye yesterday and it slowly swelled to the size of a golf ball - isaderm on it and it was gone within an hour . good to know is that it was prescribed for my chicken so will use it in future on them
    x Kath
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    Have you managed to work out what is causing the bumbles? We used to have a problem with our big Cuckoo Marans. Took us a while to realise that they were caused from jumping on & off a branch in the garden, rather than the perch in the hut.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    yesHelen - shes a houdini ........ive still got the temporary fencing up used to segregate the bluebelles and rather than go through the gate like everyone else , she goes over the fence ,by jumping on top of it then jumping down . shes also always jumping up on benches, tables etc too and is the one that was 6ft up my apple tree in the beginning
    my main coop is quite high but ive put a chair by the door for them to jump onto to get out and ive had no problems with any others using it even the mighty Lillybeth and Sally soiux
    shes my current problem child !
    x Kath
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    jinxed myself calling her a problem child this morning ......went out to get egg and couldnt find her anywhere , checked the 3 coops , both runs , under the fruit bushes , next door ....couldnt find her anywhere and not a sound from her, then i spotted her -hanging by her leg from my buddlea bush -wedged in the stem . Luckily shes not cut herself or broken anything but a small scratch and a big bruise on her leg
    so now Pippy Longstocking is living up to her name - her bandages go up past her shin on her right leg
    limped a bit but after stuffing her face is now resting - on a breeze block , nice and comfy , not.
    i wont give her aspirin as shes bruised but will give her a dose of metacam tonight when im changing her bandages
    oh , and all this happened whilst i was on the phone arranging to buy 3 hens -coming tomorrow - a leghorn and 2 barred rocks ....intended to just get 2 but 3 is close enough!
    Kath x
  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    Your birds are accident prone, Kath (Who is talking?....so are mine). Hopefully she'll make a full recovery.

    Glad to hear that you have some more hens coming.

    I'm currently allowing one of my hens to sit. She's a newbie, so I'm not sure if anything will hatch. Daughter's conures have 4 babies. She's away on holiday and is paying for a carer to go in daily to attend to them. I hope they are OK.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    good luck with the hatching, hope theyre all born with little pink booties for you
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    It's not really funny but I couldn't help smiling at the mental picture that conjured up! Was she hanging upside down, or just a bit off the ground? So lucky that you realised that she was missing so soon.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    just a bit off the ground thankfully - there are several stems all twisted and she got wedged between two by her leg - she had tried to get out but ended up upside down
    i put arnica cream on her and the big green/ black bruise has already gone completely . she is , as we speak gripping on to the top of a wire cage which i have around my beans - its not ridgid so shes swaying back and fore and having to grip tightly - stealing my runner bean leaves ......on a positive note this proves that her bumbles and graze cant be hurting her at the mo
    x Kath
  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    Good news on your wayward hen, Kath.Sounds as though she is very much on the mend. Runner bean leaves are really popular with sheep, too.....they'll demolish the whole plant in a matter of seconds.

    The baby conures are feathering up nicely and one is already adult weight! (4g to 75g in just 3 weeks...what a growth rate!

    Have you got your new hens yet?

  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    thanks Sandie . took her back to the vets for her arranged check up yesterday . saw a different vet but she said theyre looking good and to just continue with the bathing etc for a few weeks but suggested i can stop the tylan in the next few days
    im still baffled - the tell tale scabs have gone but new pale scabs are there which look a bit yellowish to me on one foot but vet reckons theyre fine . i havent had any pus out of her at all and theres been no swelling so not your typical bumblefoot unless the creams ive been using have penetrated and killed the bacteria without breaking the skin . i cant think that theres a plug of pus there or she wouldnt be able to grip tightly to the wire fencing
    dont understand it but feeling really lucky
    another update - Buffy has been laying soft shells since her myco episode and she had a pretty persistant prolapse 2 weeks ago but is fine now and pooping normally and shes stopped laying and gone into moult -yay!
    the prolapse was down to her poo again and not an egg but thats settled now too
    yes ive got the 3 newbies - Zelda a VERY flighty leghorn and Ziggy and Jasmine the barred rocks . they eat from my hand through the wire but dont feel safe when im in with them . seem to be settling well and dont see any aggression amonst them . Pippy doesnt half swear at them though when she can see them eating something thats blatantly obviously better than what ive given her !
    x Kath
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    Very interesting names Kath! How many in your flock now?
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    hi
    ive got 8 now . a nice number for my garden - the 12 i had before was a bit much even though most were bantams.
    Zelda is the heroine from one of rachels favourite games and Jasmine went along with the princess theme so Rachel named those two and i liked Ziggy because her markings are all over the place ...theres also ziggy stardust
    Jasmine was frolicking in the run this morning , something i havent seen since Georgies chicks used to do it . either shes still young or shes very happy there.
    they managed to escape into the garden yesterday but found their way back quickly when George ran down the path . Both Pippy and Ester flew in to their pen despite the fencing several times just to make sure the newbies treats and food wasnt any better than theirs and also Ester needed to teach them that when Ester is eating noone goes near her even if theres 3 of you coming at all directions and youre twice her size. No aggression returned by the newbies which is a relief to note
    x kath
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    Are you sure the food isn't better on the other side of the fence? (Missing the emojis here)
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    Doesnt matter any more - Ester and Pippy invaded their run so many times it taught the newbies how to get out so theyve integrated themselves.Bit early for my liking but so far so good and they seem to accept that the two white ninjas are above them and are showing no signs of aggression to the silkies and Buffy
    Zelda has come into lay - beautiful white eggs that ive never had before - had various shades of cream but not this white
    Back to the bumblefoot - the big one is doing really well , bits of scab coming off easily with no bleeding and new skin underneath . the smaller one doesnt look right though- the scab came off but there was just a gap underneath , no pus and no plug but there seems to be a lot of dead skin over the top - like you get from a blister after its burst so debating changing tactics for that one. Due to go back to the vet this week some time for a check up so will report back later !
    x Kath
  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    How are things going , Kath?
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    edited September 3
    thanks for asking Sandie
    i stopped the epsom baths and started washing her in antibac handwash and shes looking much cleaner . ive also stopped the prid as the skin on her whole sole started drying and peeling off . ive also had to change the bandaging methods as the vetwrap was starting to chaffe between her toes . still changing her bandage twicwe a day as shes still managing to get dirt into the area. im using isoderm on whats left of the scabs and savlon or sudocream around the pad and between the toes . im wrapping with strips of cotton lint before the vetwrap. she was looking really good last night.
    Buffy is back to her normal self thank goodness. no more eggs and no prolapsing for ages touch wood . she still insists that she sleeps in the hospital cage and who am i to tell queen B where to sleep ! the 2 white ninjas aka Ester and Pippy still respect her as head hen which is puzzling the newbies a bit as she was keeping out of their way for a while . shes back in the mix now though in the middle during feeding frenzies
    nasty insident yesterday .. Buffys first act of duty every morning is to saunter down the path with me then jump into the main coop to turf the 2 silkies out- Bluebell flew out and misjudged her path landing right in the bowl of water, poor thing was soaked
    the newbies have settled really quickly - my quickest ever but i think i may be looking quite manly in my old age as ive only got to look at Ziggy and she squats. shes not laying yet and Jazzy is moulting but Zelda is laying well but on a mini break atm
    how are things with you? and how are the daughters babies doing?
    xKath
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    I've obviously been looking manly for years since mine have always squatted for me!
  • sandiesbrahmassandiesbrahmas Super Moderator
    Sounds as though the bumble foot is doing as well as can be expected.....awful complaint!
    Some hens are really good to squat for anything, but my current group don't generally do it. You ladies clearly have 'The Knack'.............
    Great that the newbies have settled in.
    Strange how chickens sort out their order. My AJ (A***hole Junior...son of A***hole, is big, has a tendency to run at anybody or anything (dog terrified of him), but is totally subservient to Mr Glas (Blue Partridge Brahma) who is smaller and never aggressive with people, but is happy to chase AJ off anywhere, anytime.
    Unfortunately one of my daughter's baby conures died today )had to be her favourite and the one she planned to keep). The 'exotics' vet she was taking him to thought it was likely to be some 'congenital problem'.
    I've currently got some chicks (hatched out at the 11th hour on the incubator as silly first-time mum decided to make loads of room under herself to allow one chick to hatch, thereby dislodging another 5 to brave sheep shed temperature and humidity (pretty cold!). A quick race to the house with the cold-feeling 'due to hatch' eggs (2 pipped) in my pocket, fire up the incubator, and out came 4 chicks over the next 24 hours. She's such a laid-back hen that I took the chicks back, stood her up, shoved them under her, and instantly adopted
    I have another hen sitting on two potatoes......I'll try to do the same with her.
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    lol Sandie are you growing chicks or chips??????????
    tell your daughter im sorry to hear about the little conure
    what breed are the new chicks or are they your own eggs?
    ive always found that the second in command is more aggressive than the top hen / cock- like they have a henchman with the top hen having the brains but the second the brawn
    Helen , can i ask a personal question ......do you scratch their backs when they squat - mine seem to wait for it . ...am i being understanding or perverted ?
    why do i feel like ive just come out :) :)
    Kath x
  • solarbatssolarbats Senior Member
    OOh er Kath - what a carry on! I do scratch their backs, and while I'm at it I take the opportunity to do a mite check.
    There - confessions out of the closet all around!🤣

    And Sandie - I'm guessing yours don't squat for you because they have more than enough boys to choose from😁
  • undautriundautri Senior Member
    saw the vet on thursday . very pleased with one foot , not so much with the other . she took the scab off the small bumble and theres good skin under it but it bled so theres a scab growing back now . she decided to change tactics and gave me f10 antiseptic solution to bathe her twice a day . she only gave me about 200 mls though so not enough to stand her in it so im just using it on cotton wool and holding it on . she also wanted Pippy back on abs but even though ive got loads of tylan she prescribed enrocare - identical to baytril and the very same i had for Buzz years ago when he died . im more convinced than ever now that they gave me the wrong stuff for him- the injectable- as it smelled strong and this oral version has no smell
    the fun part is that this young vet instructed me to measure how much water she drinks each day and halve it and add 7mls to it twice a day so shes sure to drink it all.???????? still trying to work it out but in the meantime im mixing 7mls with about 40 mls of water and syringing it
    when i got home and cleaned her to put her bandages back i noticed the scab on her right foot was loose so rightly or wrongly pulled it off - it bled and revealed a hole with light coloured stuff at the edges - not a surgeon so cant identify it so was afraid to try pulling it out so im giving it a good clean and keeping her locked up in the polish cage to make sure no dirt gets into it . poor thing is climbing the walls desperate to get out but its for her own good
    so the bumblefoot treatment goes on and on but at least shes not limping at all and is eating well so im hoping its not bothering her too much
    x kath
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